OK then WHY are Republicans in Government all over America ok with the past 7 years of open borders from the south?

WHY are they pushing so hard for “amnesty?”

The answer to all of these greedy moves and unpatriotic acts are very simple, an open border makes corporations more money in lower wages and it undermines the wages that Americans make as well and that takes priority over a political party's long range future.

The answer to all of these greedy moves and unpatriotic acts are very simple, an open border makes corporations more money in lower wages and it undermines the wages that Americans make as well and that takes priority over a political party's long range future.

They want to give every detail (most are untrue details) about "terror" because it hlpes them win elections but they don't want us knowing any details of negative job growth because that DOESN'T win them elections.

I hope people are starting to see the BS that has overpowered the republican party and they vote accordingly.

If people need to see visuals of what I'm talking about they should rent the movie "wag the dog" and then read Orwell’s “1984”  

That sums it up quite well.

---

Those that give up freedom for security deserve neither.

Ben Franklin

MANdirtEXCUSES:

REALKILLER<

BILL CLINTON PUT NO MONEY INTO OUR MILITARY AND DIDNT GIVE A SHIT ABOUT THEM.  IT IS HIS FAULT THERE WAS NO FUNDS TO BACK A WAR IF NECESSARY BECAUSE HIS NIEVE ASS, AND HIS ADVISORS THOUGHT THERE WAS NOW AN EVERLASTING PEACE.  HE WAS TOO BUSY EXPANDING OUR GOVERNMENT, RATHER THAN PAYING ATTENTION TO OTHER COUNTRIES.

CLINTONS JUST TO BLAME AS BUSH

I had to quote this post one more time because it's probably the most "Orwellian" post I've ever seen here.

Orwell spoke in great detail how the easiest way to convince people of an untrue reality is to repeat the lie over and over even when truth stares us in the face and to take it one step farther you also have to make a case for the enemy pushign for exactly what you yourself are pushing for.

Think about how many flag waving Americans are currently backing a policy where Bush and the phone companies are exempt from charges for wipetapping Americans.

Normally Americans would be marching in the streets against this type of Government expansion but as you see in MD's post above the reality has been swithced. The Democrats are the guilty ones who expand Government even though a gigantic (and very illegal and unconstitutional)  Republican expansion is staring us right in the face.

That right there is as Orwell as Orwell gets.

Reread MD's post above. The entire post is untrue and not only that it defies many forms of logic.

He some how tries to justify that Clinton is responsible for Iraq because he cut the military.

I went over the details of this lie in a prior post but for the sake of argument lets say Bill Clinton was the only President to EVER cut the military.

First of all and correct me if I'm wrong but isn't it the obligation of the CURRENT President to find out the troop numbers PRIOR to starting a war?

Rumsfeld said many times "you fight with the military that you have" which means he and Bush KNEW the military was shorthanded but now that begs the next question.....

Did Bush or Rumsfeld ever explain to the American people or our Congress the actual idea they had in mind for Iraq?

They spoke of finding WMD's and this was a job that 300 UN inspectors could handle.

Then they spoke of removing saddam which would take 30 Navy Seals to pull off or 1 Iraqi spy.

Not only did they know that the military would not be able to handle the mission they had planned but they weren't even honest with ANYONE about the real plans they had in store for Iraq.

If you are President and you know the previous President chopped the military and you are hell bent on starting a war then wouldn't you launch a promotional campaign for recruitment PRIOR to the war you want to start and not AFTER?

MD also touched on "eternal peace" which is also Orwellian.
MD admitted without even noticing in saying that, that we HAD peace during the Clinton years.

He also tried to some how make a connection that because Clinton had peace during his tenure that it was some how Clintons fault that we LOST peace after his tenure.

Orwell would be laughing at that one.

This is like the people who say they'll gladly give up liberty for freedom without ever realizing that it's the same thing.

---

Those that give up freedom for security deserve neither.

Ben Franklin

Let's take an honest look at 9/11 and at the core of what really caused it.

Air bases in Saudi Arabia.

PERIOD.

Osama has said many times it's not even about our support for Israel over Palestine.

Don't get me wrong, I'm sure that he's never been happy about that but Palestine is NOT Saudi Arabia and he's NOT Palestinian, he's Saudi Arabian. His uproar didn't start way back when Israel was given the land. His uproar started after we built air bases on Holy land in Saudi Arabia.

Now I know the corporate media NEVER says this but if you read everything Osama has ever said in regards to attacks against western society it's based on America "tainting" Saudi Holy land in Saudi Arabia by building bases.

Now let's play the little game of looking in the mirror for a minute by putting the shoe on the other foot.

Let's not even pick an enemy of ours, lets' pick a friend.....Let's say Canada wanted to build a small military base here in the states.

Would we be ok with that?

NO.

But they are our friend right? Yes....but NO to a military base.

Ok, now lets say they wanted to build a military installation on Church property.

Would we be ok with that?

HELL NO!

Now think of the difference in Church property and legimate Holy land.

BIG DIFFERENCE.

Now remember that Canada is our friend.

Let's now look at how Saudi Arabians think of us.
70% have always have hated us and now it's roughly 88%.

Let's think of a Country where the American people hate 70% of their population.....

I can't think of one......Let's go with North Korea.

OK, so North Korea works a deal with our Government to build a military installation on Church property here in the states.

Obviously millions of Americans would be livid.

Now the obvious question becomes how long will it take before some PATRIOTIC American sets off a bomb somewhere in North Korea?

If they couldn't get to North Korea and couldn't get to the North Korean Government then they will then go after a North Korean neighborhood in a country somewhere on Earth that contains North Korean people.

Now here is the next question.....

Would we consider the American that bombed the North Koreans "patriotic" or "terrorist?"

Many Americans would not promote such a violent act but they also wouldn't do anything to stop that way of thinking.

I'm in no way trying to justify the horrible acts of 9/11 but I am merely stating a case that we would easily be as violent and vengful if an enemy built a military installation on our Holy Land.

let me rephrase this using anothere example.

If Muslims decided to build a military bse where Jesus was crucified in Israel would we be upset if Israel bombed them?

Would we be upset in the US Government was involved in bombing them.

If you answered "no" to those questions AND you hate Muslims who hate Americans then you are a hypocrite.

I'm not throwing rocks at anyone. I'm still p*ssed off at what happened on 9/11.

How many Americans are mad at what happened on 7/7?

How many Americans actually know what happened on 7/7?

Less than 20%.

Think about that.

Anyone in America that denies we face masive media control is out of their minds.

They don't tell us WHY Osama Bin Laden and his gang of rats hate us.

They don't tell us that our allies are facing the wrath of our horrible foreign policy.

They don' tell us Reagan "cut and run" out of Beirut and it was a smart move.  

They don't tell us Reagan and Bush senior chopped our military.  

They don't tell us that swift boat guys are lying about John Kerry.

They don't tell you that Barrack Obama is a Christian.

They don't tell us that the corporations hate Barrack Obama.

They don't tell us that lobbyist hate Barrack Obama.

They don't even tell us that Erickson discovered our country.

They don't even tell us Pilgrims landed in Virginia not in Plymouth Rock.

They don't even tell us Jesus was born in the fall.

We are controlled.

If we can admit that we are controlled and we can resign ourselves to the idea that we are controlled then maybe....just maybe we might be able to start seeing through their lies.

and maybe we'll vote accordingly.

c ya

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

---

Those that give up freedom for security deserve neither.

Ben Franklin

TheREALkiller206:

OK then WHY are Republicans in Government all over America ok with the past 7 years of open borders from the south?

WHY are they pushing so hard for “amnesty?”

There are several reasons why this is happening and you have hit on just a few.  Here are some more to consider.  First, the hispanic population is growing and will very soon be a majority in the US.  With this in mind, the Republicans want to be regarded as the party of choise for the hispanic community and its members who will receive this amnesty, path to citizenship, or whatever you want to call it.  Second, they will represent a new source of taxes.  Third, they will be governed by our laws and punished for violating them.  Finally, it would be better that they become citizens than F'n "guest workers", which would be even worse for US workers.  We need to extend residency status to all illegals who reside in the US and give them a chance to earn the right to stay and be a legitimate part of our great country.  However, if that trust is violated, then the deportation process should be streamlined.  One thing you can count on is that the only true amnesty will be for the employers.       

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Are you like me, confused

If you think that the problems in America start with the Hispanics, then you haven't been teaching at a public school in Ga. for 29 years like I have. I guarantee you, all the Hispanics want to do is work. There are more Blacks and Whites who want to be sorry, than any number of them! I've seen it! The Hispanics want to be Americans, and would give anything to do so. The sorry ass blacks and whites who are already here don't value that! They just want to sit on their sorry asses and take from the folks who work to make their lives kinda' liveable. They don't aspire to do any better. I will continue to vote democratic to help all of us folks who work to make a decent wage, but we aren't living a comfy life! We work because we want to maybe be able to live our dreams of helping our kids have a comfortable life someday. We have what we need, because we have worked for it. We don't have much of what we want!  And we know that the Dems will help us have a better life. We know that the Republicans don't care about anyone but the top 10%. And the rich get richer, unless we vote for the Democrats. I've lived long enough to see it! Don't be fooled into voting for the new Republican scare tactics, the Mexican thing!!! MIke

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The original "Rooster" from the RR board!

But rooster, what happens to us when the immigrants work for 10 bux an hour with no expectation of benefits.  They come here, cram 8 of them in a tiny, cheap apartment.  They work for a few years and go back home where that 10 an hour is worth 20.  Its unfair.  Its great for the owner of the landscaping co or w/e, but it sux for the americans who have dont cram into a shit apartment for 5 years.

The democrats are going to solve all your problems!!!!!!!   they keep telling you how shitty america has become, yet most people are still fine.  The dems give the scare tactics. lol

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One can only receive and retain

Let those folks line up and I'll count 'em! There are no Whites or Blacks waiting to take those jobs. If there are, I'll line up with them and help them get those jobs! And if they will be willing to sign up for them and pay taxes, I'll pay them for them. Mike

---

The original "Rooster" from the RR board!

sorry about my poor knowledge on american/or any politics

what's the deal with Super Tuesday? why is so important? are the result final?

i think im a bit off topic here, but i couldnt figure what is Super tuesday 

---

"We got famous off singing about a chicken."
- Sean Kinney
"I believe the Internet is inherently evil."
- Jerry Cantrell

MANdirtEXCUSES:

But rooster, what happens to us when the immigrants work for 10 bux an hour with no expectation of benefits.  They come here, cram 8 of them in a tiny, cheap apartment.  They work for a few years and go back home where that 10 an hour is worth 20.  Its unfair.  Its great for the owner of the landscaping co or w/e, but it sux for the americans who have dont cram into a shit apartment for 5 years.

The democrats are going to solve all your problems!!!!!!!   they keep telling you how shitty america has become, yet most people are still fine.  The dems give the scare tactics. lol

Name one democratic candidate using scare tactics?

Is it a scare tactic to say that McCain and Romney will follow Bush doctrine? They themselves say that every single day. That's a sick reality bro.

Is it a scare tactic to say that McCain and romney will keep our troops in iraq forever? They say this every day bro. McCain predicted 50 years.

Are you ok with 50 years of middle east welfare on your dime?
Are you ok with our Troops being so worn out that we couldn't ask them to fight a real war against a real enemy right now?

Do you want me to go down the list of Republicans who use scare tactics every day?

I wish I had a dime for every Republican that has said if a democrat wins we'll be attacked by terrorists again.

McCain said it in every speech last week.

He even said a vote for Romney is a vote for Osama Bin laden.

This is the sh*t that America does not need.

Bush/Rove spent 7 years divided us and now we'll see the divide grow farther with McCain or Romney.

Now onto your next complaint....illegal immigration.

You act as though Democrats are to blame for any of this.

I gave you the solid data for this and I guess you skipped it.

The day Clinton left office there were 2.8 million illegals in America.

Now the number is between 11 and 40 million, 28 million being the most commonly touted number.

That's ten times more because of YOUR PARTY and your thirst for cheap labor.

Now suddenly it's the democrats fault.

Are you some how going to ignore reality and say the republican party is NOT for cheap labor? Are you going to say your party isn't for ILLEGAL labor? Are you going to say your party doesn't stand for outsourcing of jobs?

You are like a repeating record Bro and whoever you are getting yoru info from if completely full of shit.

Please look outside that scope of media, family, etc...for your info.

You blamed Clinton for cutting the military but it was really Reagan who started that.

You blame Democrats for dividing America when it's been Republicans doing this.

You blame Democrats for illegal immigration and that's just ridiculous.

You blame Democrats for runaway welfare but who is the only person to lower welfare numbers? CLINTON

How many times do you have to be proven wrong before you finally go back to your source and call them an idiot?

PS: Most people are not "still" fine.

I make enough money to NOT qualify for the (ridiculous) tax rebate but I live pay day to pay day.

My raise was 1.7% because my company is greedy despite brekaing records for profits.

Gasoline is $3.30 a gallon.
My electricity is through the roof.
My health insurance doubled on January 1st.
Lindseys price of college shot up.

and I'm one of the lucky ones.

and my problems are NOTHING compared to someone in Michigan or Oklahoma who's entire city dried up thanks to tax cuts for outsourcing jobs (Republican idea to raise profits)

When Bush gave the last rebate 50% of America lived pay day to pay day.

now that number is over 80%.

Think about that.
Did trickle down work?

of course not.

It didn't work in 8 years of Reagan and it didn't work in 7 years of Bush and it will never work.

Just because you give a business owner a small tax cut does not mean they'll hire someone or give their employees raises.

DEMAND is the sole force that drives hiring new employees or paying better wages.

Tax cuts FOR hiring new employees (Clinton method) WORKS.

Anyone with a brain knows that you don't give everyone a tax cut and "hope" they hire someone.

It doesn't work.

trickle down only seperates the rich from the middle even farther.

If you are ok with corporate welfare and tax cuts for the elite then so be it but you aren't creating jobs or opportunities with that mindset.

You are allowing a guy that drives a Porsche to upgrade to a Ferrari ON YOUR DIME.

done.

 

 

 

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Those that give up freedom for security deserve neither.

Ben Franklin

pattipatti:

sorry about my poor knowledge on american/or any politics

what's the deal with Super Tuesday? why is so important? are the result final?

i think im a bit off topic here, but i couldnt figure what is Super tuesday 

I will tell you what will happen. The results aren't in yet but the ending of this "play" was written long ago.

Super Tuesday is just a continuation of the fictional election process in America. This is the day where the most states vote for their candidates.

The corporations that drive this entire machine have gotten rid of most of the good candidates before today and now we have 5 to choose from.

Two Democrats (Obama and Hillary) who will not become President and Romney and McCain one of which WILL become President and Mike Huckabee who is a Christian candidate that organized religion in America hates (go figure) so he has no shot either.

I wish the corporations would leave us out of this process and just stick the corporate chosen Republican corporate whore into the White House every 8 years and save us the hassle.

Check this out......

People in American call CNN the "Clinton news network" as though that corporation is some how "left leaning."

Look at CNN's main election page right now.

They know people will run to them for last minute info and look at their ,list of issues.

http://www.cnn.com/POLITICS/

 This is how the corporate media works.

The issues are (In order)

Abortion
Immigration
Iraq
Social security
Taxes
Same sex marriage

Except for Iraq these are issues that only republicans think are the biggest issues and if a person were to look at CNN and what they "deem" important issues and then went to the 4 candidate websites they'd see Romney and McCain speaking on those particular issues.

It's mind manipulation at it's finest.

It gets even better. Look up towards the top of the links they provide. Only 1 link is there criticizing a candidate for not being forthcoming and that is OBAMA.

The Republican candidates lie about each other and the Democrats in every speech but the "liberal" media are acting like Obama is lying based on the title of the link.

These small things influence Americans (sadly)

They want Hillary vs Romney or Hillary vs. McCain and BOTH Republicans beat Hillary head to head.

You would think that this would tell people to vote for Obama but we are stupid, misguided, naive, apathetic, etc....

here comes 4 more years of corporate rule.

Thanks "liberal" media!

 

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Those that give up freedom for security deserve neither.

Ben Franklin

I am so glad to hear that we have nothing better to worry about here than abortion and same sex marriages, I know it keeps me up at night   Let's get some real problems..

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LMFAO!!!

 

Whats funny is I had to make a quick stop here to read up on some issues before voting..... not that I would let any of you make up my mind..... its just strikes me as funny I would come here to read up on issues and opinions as well as other news worthy(turns on sarcasm) websites like CNN, FOX, etc.... 

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I hate your Volvo!!!!

http://www.myspace.com/1gritvox

My band
http://www.myspace.com/gritbrandmusic

Don't forget "steroids" and "cheating in professional sports"...who FN cares?  No need to worry about the "voting" issue.  There are efforts to 'fix' that through electronic voting.  H.R. 811 is in the works now to confront this, but could end up ushering in the very things it's designed to prevent.      

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Are you like me, confused

It gets better.

I think people remember me "predicting" in the past few weeks that Romney (and Gulliani at that time) were the  clear corporate choices over McCain.

Now in the past few days guys like Rush Limbaugh, Hannity, Savage, Fox Noise have ALL blasted McCain.

Even James Dobson (evil political wannabe who brainwashes Christians) said he would never vote for McCain and McCain would be the worst Republican choice of his lifetime.

This isn't the evangelical wing of the party speaking.
This isn't the conservative wing or the libertarian wing.

NONE of those wings have any pull in this process any longer.

This is the corporate wing of the Republican party which is now the ONLY wing that matters because the other groups sat back and allowed this to happen.

When you see Liberals protest outside of a Hillary event try to learn something about that. These are free thinking people who are not going to allow their representatives move towards something they don't believe in. In this case it was the Iraq war.

If Republicans would have started doing this during the reagan years and continued to today we wouldn't see corporations running your party and everyone else left out in the cold.

You have to police your own.

Instead they side track their voters by bringing up the past "Clinton hurt our military" and "Clinton lied about sex and weed" or "special interest groups want alternative fuels."

 .....wag the dog.

Focus on your own party and protest against your own party when you see them do something you don't agree with. Don't tow the party line. Force them to move the party line towards what YOU demand.

If there are Republicans reading this you should be outraged at this overpowering of your party and you should be embarrassed that you've sat back over the last 2, 5 or 15 or 20 years and watched your political party become highjacked by greedy corporations who have done everything possible to rewrite laws, impose corporate judges into our system and to brainwash the voter base inside and out, trounce on our rights, start wars for profits, create a low wage environment here and and outsource others abroad.

Look around, right now you have more than half of Christians in the Republican party denying global warming.

I thought Christians were supposed to care about the planet God gave us?

How could this happen?

easy...It's called controlled message through the media and through the Church.

You have over half of the Christians in the party fighting against healthcare for children.

How sick is that?

Again...controlled media message distorts debate and allows corporations more time to position themselves int the best position possible.

These corporate right wingers are telling people that an "open market" will allow  people to get healthcare for their children.

UHHHHH........we're waiting...........when exactly is this going to happen?

We had 10 million uninsured in 2004. Now we have almost 50 million.

and that doesn't include people who don't have jobs.

Bush says that's a million people but really it's about 4.5 million.

96% of people that don't have jobs don't have healthcare.

I thought this was the "pro-life" party?

I thought this was the "family values" party?

I thought this was the "compassionate" party?

This is what happens when corporations control the talking points. You can get a ton of people to ignore reality and pick sides by what they hear from the press.

This is what causes.....

Christians who support the death penalty.

Conservatives who support massive corporate welfare in Iraq.

Libertarians who are ok with the Patriot Act.

Republicans who put our Constitution second behind the all seeing eye of neocons.

We are losing our minds in this country.

 

 

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Those that give up freedom for security deserve neither.

Ben Franklin

SoFarAway:

Don't forget "steroids" and "cheating in professional sports"...who FN cares?  No need to worry about the "voting" issue.  There are efforts to 'fix' that through electronic voting.  H.R. 811 is in the works now to confront this, but could end up ushering in the very things it's designed to prevent.      

Not only did the RNC usher the electronic voting machines, they also purchased the media which tends to influence people and they have also have been know to drive an election up to the Supreme Court to change the outcome whenn they don't like the result.

We all know the proven method of cover for rigged elections....."the exit polls were way way off!"

...end of debate. No investigations, no recounts, NOTHING.

When people repeat the BS that our media is "left leaning" the first thing I always say is "If our media favored Democrats then why on Earth would they allow the Supreme Court to break the law and decide the outcome of a Presidential election?"

....especially in favor of a Republican?

If the media were remotely honest about that then we'd know that no recounts were completed that favored Bush and instead of admitting defeat they did the one thing that would surely work for them.... the Supreme Court jumped in to bail out the corporate party and we should all be marching in the streets in protest.

But since the media didn't tell that vital information we didn't react properly.

It really hit home for me when I lived in DC from 2001-2006 and on weekends we would drive through DC and some days there would be 150,000 protestors marching on the national mall and not one media outlet in America would cover it.

The media has a choice.

They can cover the news as it happens.

They can cower to their advertisers who's profits would be hurt by this type of "news" like anti war protests or "news" about mercury in our fish we eat or spreading accurate information information about global warming whcih hurts those generious oil companies who buy ads all day long.

Take a guess who pays the bills/profits in our media?

Advertisers.

I remember in DC I'd turn on a radio station like Air America and they'd say "we are interviewing Richard Clarke next" and all of a sudden the station would "magically" drop off the air a few minutes later.

Is this America or China?

Clear Channel buying up a number 1 rated radio network in Cincinatti and shutting it down immediately.

Why would a corporation buy a top ranked radio station and shut it down?

If they spoke anti-corporation thoughts or ideas I guess it makes sense huh? For a corporation to buy it and shut the doors.

Censorship at it's finest right here in the good ol' US of A.

When is the last time anyone has heard anything about New Orleans still being f*cked up?

If the media was "liberal" then believe me they'd be using that dagger on Republicans every single day.

Do you think the American people realize that America was the last civilized nation to deem Darfur a genocide?

Half of America still doesn't know what the word Darfur means let alone thousands fo kids are getting murdered there as we speak, women are being raped as we speak and villages are being burned as we speak.

How many Americans know that 4 million Iraqi's are homeless nomads trying to find a home?

Almost a million Iraqi children are currenty misplaced.

In the past month the 700,000th innocent Iraqi was killed. Did this make the news in America? Not a chance. The (so called) Liberal washington Post puts the number at 60,000 and I guess we're all supposed to breath a sigh of relief that it's not 700,000.

That's Saddam type numbers there.....we can't have none of that!

Instead we are force fed stories about "Mary won a giant lawsuit against (insert corporation name here" hoping you get p*ssed enough that you'll side with corporations and take away Mary's right to sue (and everyone's)

....or stories about missing white girls. If enough people get outraged and if enough parents get scared that their kid will get molested or killed then maybe just maybe you'll accept the GPS chip.

MSNBC shows these propaganda tapes every single night. Turn it on....a prison show  (backing prisons being built is not a good thing) ...then an hour of...child molestors.....more prison show......more child molestor.....

"coming up next on MSNBC!!!! To catch a predator!!!!"
Yea, to trick you into getting a chip in your childs arm.

Fox News and the major networks talk about this stuff every single night.

This is no accident.

I have to run.

peace

 

 

 

 

 

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Those that give up freedom for security deserve neither.

Ben Franklin